[AlterGenesis-X]

As you may or may not know, myself and Xin have been engaged in very deep discussion regarding the religious overtones and plot in Xenogears/Xenosaga. Now, you think we may just be Xenofreaks for doing so, but a lot of it is quite interesting and puzzling together the Xenosaga series with the fifth story of the saga (Xenogears) can be quite fun. If you have any ideas of your own or have any questions please feel free to open up discussion. As soon as I remember all I have disscussed with Xin, I'll post those too.

[xin]

Oh, I just can't resist posting here. I love all the new thing's i'm finding about Gears and EPs I & II. Plus since I dont know everything about Gears I can learn from thos of you who do.
Anyways, here's something new.

Xenosaga: Pied Piper is a cell phone game in Japan that focus muchly on the past of Jan Sauer (aka Ziggy). The story also deals a bit with some of the details revealed in the ending of Episode II and can bring a better understanding of some of the details and character so far introduced. Below is a summarized version of the plot and some script translations provided by gamefaqs.com.

>>>So if you haven't beaten Episode II you may not want to read this

gamefaqs.com said:

From: Seymour_Natus (gs) | Posted: 3/2/2005 8:57:49 PM | Message Detail

I got this info from another Video game website: I'll post three since it's long, but worth reading:

---PP Cliffs Notes version---

Ziggy, aka Jan Sauer back then, was the head of a police task force whose job was to apprehend the serial killer Voyager, who was using the UMN to commit murders.

Included in his unit was an early Realian developed by Vector Industries named Lactis, and a man named Erich Webber. Jan soon found out that Erich was Voyager, who had made a non-binding contract with U-DO. In exchange for power, he had to bring the enity human souls...the last two victims were Ziggy's wife and son.

Ziggy finds out, but before he can go postal on Voyager, is approached by Wilhelm, who gives him the following offer, join his wife and child in death, or have great power and eternal life as a Testament. Ziggy chooses neither, kills Voyager, then procceds to shoot himself. Wilhelm then appears to Voyager, offers him the same thing...and Voyager accepts, becoming the black-cloaked Testament (and also the first.)

As for Lactis, I don't know what happens to him, but at one point in Pied Piper, he is contacted by chaos via telepathy, who begs him to protect Canaan. It's later found out that Wilhelm uses Realians equipped with "Canaan" to search for "shining wills" in humans, a critical factor needed for the creation of the Testaments.

Is Canaan in XSII the same? I dunno, I think it might be, my personal theory on him is that he's a computer program that's been refined over the years for this current incarnation.

Later on, at the end of PP chaos apparently splits away from Wilhelm and leaves, which probably explains the convo they have at the end of XSII somewhat.




My information on that is sketchy as it is, but according to a line from PP spoken by Wilhelm, it looks like he and chaos might have been friends, even co-workers of some sort...and it looks like chaos apparently didn't agree with what Wilhelm had/has in mind.

From: Seymour_Natus (gs) | Posted: 3/2/2005 8:59:37 PM | Message Detail

What Wilhelm says:
Wilhelm: ...YHVShVa. Don't you think it's unlike you to use human beings to get in my way? However, if you plan to do that, then I shall make my own plans...while you hide in the shadows, I shall use my own methods and make sure the matter becomes as how it should be.

But, I shall wait for you. Until the day you once again ascend onto the stage...

The inference I drew from that is that chaos and Wilhelm probably got in some sort of an arguement, and chaos left as a result. Pied Piper, like Xenosaga, doesn't explain much about this relationship...



Another part of the Story



Wilhelm and chaos' ages are undetermined.

I'm not sure when this scene takes place, but I think it's before Jan discovers Voyager. Keila is a realian, perhaps a general under Wilhelm as he refers to him as 'commander' (and not Wilhelm-sama as the Testaments do). The 'investigator' is Jan while the 'policeman' is Elrich (Voyager). Also, 'Canaan' appears to be some kind of realian software, perhaps for gathering information and intelligence, that is mass-produced. It also appears to be in the realian Lactis.


Keila: Dmitri Yuriev is on the move…
Wilhelm: He seems to be in quite a hurry, doesn’t he?
Keila: I wonder if now is a bad time to reach out to him.
Wilhelm: Don’t worry. I know Dmitri’s agenda. He is the only survivor of “the horror,” after all. And if he gets to the investigator – Lactis is with him. Lactis will surely choose to help the investigator.
Keila: And the policeman who also appeared in the Compass of Order…?
Wilhelm: *chuckles* Simply an unexpected obstacle.
Keila: Obstacle…?
Wilhelm: Indeed.
Keila: And that’s alright?
Wilhelm: It’s fine. Certainly the radiance of the investigator’s magnificent will shines beyond compare… however, he is not the only one to show such radiance.
Keila: Understood. We will deploy the realians carrying “Canaan” to search the star system for the human carrying “inshi”.
Wilhelm: Good. Men like him are of utmost necessity for the weaver of Zarathustra. (Albedo anyone?) For that purpose, “Canaan”… no, Lactis needs us to work even harder.
Keila: Yes. Then I will continue to watch over the realians carrying Canaan.
Wilhelm: Please do. Now, there are things I must attend to. May I be alone for a while?
Keila: Yes, sir.
From: Seymour_Natus (gs) | Posted: 3/2/2005 9:00:45 PM | Message Detail
More Dialogue:

Wilhelm: …Yeshua. Looking for a handout? Intruding on me like this doesn’t seem like you. Nevertheless, if that’s your intention, I’ll share my thoughts… From that place where you have hidden your dark side, I would have liked to witness the realization of all my efforts... But, I will wait. Someday you will rise to the stage once more…

And now, when Voyager becomes the Black Testament...

This is an amazing scene. From what I can gather, Voyager was trying to join with U-DO through the UMN and something went wrong. It flooded his mind with negative information and he saw the "horror of the end of the world" (apparently the same thing Yuriev saw). Wilhelm shows up to have a little 'talk' with him. Not sure when in the chronology of the game this takes place, but it's probably pretty close to the beginning. Gotta love that seductive Wilhelm rhetoric here

Voyager: U, U-DOOOOOOOOOO!! (aah! Helmer flashbacks!)
Wilhelm: It’s pointless, you know. It can’t respond to your yelling.
Voyager: ...who… the hell are you?
Wilhelm: Your new partner. I don’t know about you, but I’m really quite pleased.
Voyager: I don’t need any partner. Now my thoughts will continue to voyage on, for all eternity…
Wilhelm: That’s not much of a bluff, is it? Betrayed by Yuriev… and I don’t think those are the words of a man who just broke his contract with U-DO before my very eyes.
Voyager: …you, how do you…!?
Wilhelm: They cannot offer you the things that I can offer you. Would you consider joining me?
Voyager: What do the likes of you have to offer me?
Wilhelm: I have been watching you all along… your dazzling shining will. Couldn’t we build a wonderful friendship? After all, I already know you… always burdened by your inferiority complex. You wouldn’t have to worry about things like that anymore. I can take it all away, in this new, unknown world…
Voyager: That existence… is even as powerful as U-DO?
Wilhelm: That depends on you… if you cooperate with me, your aid would be rewarded. So, have you come up with your answer yet?
Voyager: …there’s no… other choice…
Wilhelm: I’m so glad to have your assistance.

The way it's broken up by the original poster is a bit confusing, so if you get lost on some of it i'll try to help explain

[AlterGenesis-X]

Intrestingly enough, as you know in Xenogears there is Citan Uzuki. Although, assuming he is directly related to Shion and Jin maybe false. His wife Yui was the original bearer of the Uzuki last name and taught Citan how to use the sword. If anyone from Gears is related to Shion and Jin, it's Yui.

Most revelations to follow.

[Ido_Alpha_Omega]

The connection between games would have to be a very very tiny one as all the humans are based on Deus's and Abel's DNA. I assume that Kadomony and Raziel could have kept a record of the Uzuki DNA line, but that would imply that either Jin, Shion, or a descendant/family member were a part of the Neo Jerusalem project or the higher-ups felt that their DNA was important enough to store in memory. If this is an attempt to use the Introns as a means of knowledge storage it would seem redundant as Raziel can store an insane amount of data without needing to resort to DNA segregation.

[Dweebo]

I was an active member at the old forum, one guy knew all the little religious things in the game that it had to offer. Oh, and Xenosaga wasn't made by Square...

[King Kayne]

yeah Dewwbo i was wonderin if it was and i dont believe it is... interesting why is it still here then hmmmm..... (pondering)

[The FFFanatic]

Quote

Xenosaga wasn't made by Square...

But it was made by the same people who made Gears

[Iso]

The FFFanatic, on Mar 19 2005, 05:50 PM, said:

But it was made by the same people who made Gears

I was a little confused on that whole bit...seeing as how square owned rights to Xenogears and all. Square must be pissed that Sagas happening though, seeing as how it is a direct run off.

[.Dante.]

Fighter, on Mar 31 2005, 02:39 AM, said:

I was a little confused on that whole bit...seeing as how square owned rights to Xenogears and all. Square must be pissed that Sagas happening though, seeing as how it is a direct run off.

You can say that, if Square didn't really supported monolithsoft in the project (Xeno-saga) it's pretty normal that they runned off to namco isn't it?

[dada]

I don't get why Squenix would be pissed. I'm sure the rghts to the story were sold over.